Misconceptions in the Trayvon Martin Case

by Dan Linehan on March 28, 2012

in Editorial

Twin Lakes Crime Scene

Despite the Trayvon Martin shooting being more than a month passed, misinformation and fallacious arguments continue to appear with great frequency.

Let’s take a closer look at some of the top misconceptions regarding the Trayvon Martin case.

  1. Trayvon was a normal, well-adjusted teenager.
  2. Seventeen-year-olds don’t normally have gold teeth, multiple tattoos, multiple school suspensions, friends publicly asking them for “plant” on their Facebooks, issues with graffiti, school problems with “burglary tools,” and so on.

    Trayvon Martin

    Trayvon might not have been an out-and-out criminal, but he certainly wasn’t an average teen either.

    What we do see is an escalating pattern of illegal behavior.

    Multiple tattoos may be regarded by some as nothing beyond popular fashion, but without parental consent minors cannot get them.

    Trayvon seems to have had several when he was only sixteen. Did he lie about his age or did his parents go with him when he got them?

    In the last 48 hours, we’ve found out that Martin’s 10-day suspension (which was in effect at the time of his shooting) wasn’t the only time he was suspended recently.

    In a few short months during his junior year in high school, Trayvon was suspended on three separate occasions, including one time when he was caught with a “burglary tool” and a bunch of jewelry that didn’t belong to him.

    The Miami Herald claims that in October, he was caught with a ‘burglary tool’ – a flathead screwdriver – and 12 pieces of women’s jewellery. Martin insisted that they did not belong to him.

    Earlier, he had been suspended for skipping school and showing up late to class. And most recently, in February, he was suspended again when officials found a ‘marijuana pipe’ and an empty baggie with traces of the drug.

    Certain media outlets are still spinning the story.

    NPR titled yesterday’s article, “Trayvon Martin’s Life Looking Much Like Many Teens.”

    From that piece:

    According to the Herald, Martin was suspended from school three times in recent months, for incidents ranging from tardiness to writing graffiti on school property to having a plastic bag with marijuana residue in his backpack. He had never been arrested.

    Conveniently no mention of the jewelry or the screwdriver on NPR.

  3. Discussing someone’s character is a smear campaign.
  4. Trayvon’s character matters deeply in this case.

    Since this shooting has become an extremely polarizing national news item, everyone involved requires scrutiny. That especially holds true for Trayvon, since his actions on the night of the shooting are truly at the heart of all of this.

    Not relevant?

    We have to ask ourselves, “Was Trayvon the sort of person who would viciously attack and beat Zimmerman, as Zimmerman claims?” To answer that question, we have to know as much as we can about Trayvon and how he conducted himself.

    The media has spent an inordinate amount of time looking into Zimmerman’s background. For a long while the same scrutiny was not applied to Martin. That has changed now somewhat. As more facts are coming out about who Martin was, the image many people had of him turned out to be very inaccurate.

    Trayvon no longer seems to be the innocent victim the media initially portrayed him as.

    This is not a smear campaign. It’s not blaming the victim. In fact, Martin wasn’t the victim if he unilaterally assaulted and viciously beat Zimmerman, as every piece of evidence currently seems to suggest. More on that later.

  5. George Zimmerman is racist.
  6. There is no evidence to suggest that George Zimmerman is racist and quite a lot of evidence against it.

    Zimmerman and his wife were in the big brother / big sister program and mentored two black children. That doesn’t sound like the actions of a racist to me.

    Big Brothers Logo

    His friends and family have been extremely outspoken about Zimmerman not being racist from the start. Apparently, Zimmerman grew up in a multi-cultural family and has always been anything but discriminatory.

    Joe Oliver, a long-time friend of Zimmerman’s, has been conducting interviews all this week about the topic as well.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3KvxVkouKUA

  7. George Zimmerman called Martin a “coon.”
  8. This claim has been widely debunked.

    Audio experts have attested that he said the word “punks” on the call.

    WFTV had an audio expert listen to the call, and determined that the word said was “punks.”

    Others think he may have said “crooks.” Several have mentioned that he could have even said “goons.” I’ve never heard of that expression, but apparently “goons” is actually part of the vernacular in Florida.

    In any case, Zimmerman was highly unlikely to have said “coons” while on the line with 911. To begin with, “coons” is a fairly obscure, outdated word. Very few people under the age of sixty would use that term as a racial slur, there are half-a-dozen other offensive words that are much more commonly used.

    Zimmerman has an extensive background in criminal justice. He probably wasn’t about to throw it away by littering his 911 calls with racist rhetoric. There is no record of him using any racial slurs like this on any previous 911 call.

    It seems highly unlikely he would start doing so all of the sudden, forty-some calls in.

  9. George Zimmerman was chasing Trayvon.
  10. George Zimmerman wasn’t “chasing” Trayvon. Chasing someone implies you are trying to catch up to them — there’s no evidence that was Zimmerman’s intention.

    Zimmerman was attempting to maintain visual contact. That is what he was supposed to do for his Neighborhood Watch, and that is what was being asked of him by the 911 dispatcher at the time.

    This is supported by the 911 transcript.

    Zimmerman: No you go in straight through the entrance and then you make a left…uh you go straight in, don’t turn, and make a left. Shit he’s running.

    Dispatcher: He’s running? Which way is he running?

    Zimmerman: Down towards the other entrance to the neighborhood.

    Dispatcher: Which entrance is that that he’s heading towards?

    The dispatcher was asking Zimmerman specific questions about where Martin was going, Zimmerman was answering as needed.

    Every step of the way, Zimmerman complied with the 911 operator.

    When he was asking for more information about the direction Martin went, Zimmerman provided it. When he said there was no need to pursue, Zimmerman stopped immediately.

    Dispatcher: Are you following him?

    Zimmerman: Yeah

    Dispatcher: Ok, we don’t need you to do that.

    Zimmerman: Ok

    Dispatcher: Alright sir what is your name?

    Zimmerman: George…He ran.

    At this point, Zimmerman no longer has Trayvon within eyesight, and he’s no longer even attempting to look for him.

  11. George Zimmerman should have stayed in his truck.
  12. This is a baseless argument.

    Zimmerman had no reason to think he should stay in his truck — he was reporting someone suspicious in his neighborhood and wanted to maintain visual contact with that person. He drove after them for a few minutes and the person ran away.

    At this point, it makes perfect logical sense for Zimmerman to exit the vehicle to see where the suspicious person went, because he had just called them in to the police. Otherwise, the police would get there and Zimmerman would have no idea what direction to point them in.

    If we listen to the 911 call it’s clear that Zimmerman was not chasing Trayvon. He was merely trying to see where he was going so he could relay this information to the dispatcher.

    This fact is actually crucial to the case. Things would be different had Zimmerman actually been in some sort of hot pursuit, chasing after Martin, but he never was. Zimmerman wasn’t ever close to Martin, until Martin changed directions and confronted Zimmerman after the 911 call.

  13. George Zimmerman started the fight.
  14. There is absolutely no evidence of this. It seems pretty clear that Zimemrman’s goal was to report someone he didn’t recognize in his community, not to pick a fight with them.

    To believe that Zimmerman picked a fight with Martin, we first have to ask ourselves why Zimmerman would want to start a fight that he would almost certainly lose, against someone who was 10 years younger than him, half a foot taller, and in excellent physical shape.

    Take a look at this picture of Trayvon and decide for yourself whether you would instigate a physical confrontation with him.

    I would not pick a fight with him.

    If Zimmerman wanted to start a fight or harass some random teenager, why would he call 911 before doing so?

    Calling in a suspicious person report does not make any sense if Zimmerman wanted to go out and start physical confrontations.

    Had Zimmerman proceeded to attack Martin, the cops would have arrived a few minutes later and Zimmerman would have been arrested for assaulting a minor. There would be no valid reason for him to do that whatsoever.

    The concept of Zimmerman initiating violence makes no sense in context with the rest of the evidence we have.

  15. George Zimmerman was simply let go at the scene.
  16. Zimmerman was not simply “released” at the scene by the Sanford police.

    He was handcuffed and placed in the back of the squad car where he first received treatment for his injuries.

    Cuffed and brought in.

    Police then questioned Zimmerman for five hours at police headquarters the night of February 26th. All of that was without an attorney present.

    A very risky move for Zimmerman, but he apparently felt he had nothing to hide.

  17. Zimmerman just lost the fight.
  18. There is a certain subset of people who continue to make derogatory statements about Zimmerman along the lines of:

    - He’s a wimp who was mad because he lost a fist-fight and shot the kid afterward.
    - He brought a gun to an otherwise fair fight.
    - Getting beaten up doesn’t mean that you get to shoot the other guy afterward.

    I would agree with all of those if they applied to this case in any way, but they don’t.

    Zimmerman says he was unilaterally attacked by Martin. He never wanted to fight in the first place. It’s not as if he agreed to something physical and then proceeded to shoot Martin at the end of it.

    One minute he was on the phone with police, the next he was knocked down with one punch, and getting beaten incessantly.

  19. George Zimmerman was bigger than Trayvon.
  20. George Zimmerman weighed more than Trayvon. That only matters when the extra weight in question is muscle.

    By all accounts, Zimmerman was not in good shape. He was out of breath on the 911 call after jogging for only a few seconds.

    Trayvon had a six inch height advantage, as well as a ten year age advantage, and was generally much more fit overall.

    Update: Surprise, the weight figures the media was pushing for Zimmerman were nowhere near accurate.

    While he weighed 240 lbs. back in 2005, he has lost a considerable amount of weight in the last seven years. Zimmerman is described by friends as currently weighing only 170 lbs.

    Zimmerman is currently 5’8 / 170 lbs.

  21. George Zimmerman had no right to pursue Trayvon.
  22. Zimmerman saw someone in his neighborhood who looked suspicious and he had every right to follow-up with them and talk to them without being assaulted.

    In this case however, Zimmerman never even got the chance. He never got close enough to ask Martin anything before he lost visual contact, then headed back towards his truck to meet police.

  23. It was Trayvon’s voice screaming for help on the 911 call.
  24. This is probably one of the most critical misconceptions of the case. When the 911 tapes were released, nearly everyone assumed it was Trayvon screaming for his life on the recording. It was horrifying and very emotional.

    But the evidence shows this terrified voice was actually Zimmerman’s, not Trayvon’s.

    The only witness to the assault describes Zimmerman as being on the bottom in a “ground-and-pound” position, screaming for help. That witness told them, “I’m going to call 911,” and ran inside to do so.

    On the 911 recording we continue to hear Zimmerman’s screams for help.

    There is a continuity there — between what the witness saw, and what we hear on the tapes. Zimmerman was screaming for help when the witness first saw the fight, he was still pinned down and screaming for help when the 911 call was recorded.

    Zimmerman was screaming for his life as Trayvon continued to beat him, even after a witness told them directly that he was calling 911. This alone shows that Trayvon had no regard for any sort of fair fight.

  25. George Zimmerman is white.
  26. For those who don’t already know, Zimmerman is hispanic. Half-white on his Father’s side and half Peruvian.

    Zimmerman, not white.

    This misconception is understandable, as Zimmerman was documented as being white in the original Sanford police report.

  27. George Zimmerman disobeyed 911 orders.
  28. Zimmerman did not ever disobey 911 dispatcher orders. If you listen to the tapes, the dispatcher says, “We don’t need you to [follow him.]” And Zimmerman says, “Ok.”

    Dispatcher: Are you following him?

    Zimmerman: Yeah

    Dispatcher: Ok, we don’t need you to do that.

    Zimmerman: Ok

    The conversation continues, and it’s obvious from his tone of voice that Zimmerman is no longer actively pursuing Martin.

    How exactly would Zimmerman have caught back up to Martin after the call, when he couldn’t keep up with him in the first place?

  29. Trayvon was justified in punching Zimmerman.
  30. The only way Trayvon would have been justified in punching Zimmerman would have been if Zimmerman successfully chased Martin down until he caught up with him. Even then, it would have been questionable.

    But that is not the scenario we are dealing with. Martin initiated the confrontation, and almost certainly didn’t feel threatened while he was fighting Zimmerman.

    Martin had him pinned to the ground and continued to beat him incessantly while Zimmerman was screaming for help. There is no justification for that.

  31. It has anything to do with hoodies.
  32. For a few sentimental days, large groups of people were taking photos wearing hoodies to show solidarity with Trayvon Martin.

    There’s nothing wrong with that per se, except that this case has nothing to do with hoodies. Trayvon was not shot because he was wearing a hoodie or any other article of clothing.

    Hoodies

    Trayvon was shot because he continued to viciously beat a man ten years his senior, while that man was crying out desperately for help. A man who had done nothing to him except briefly follow him as part of his Neighborhood Watch duties.

  33. George Zimmerman was remorseless after the shooting.
  34. Multiple witnesses who arrived after the shooting saw Zimmerman trying to stop Martin’s bleeding. This alone signifies how much Zimmerman didn’t want to shoot Martin. He simply had no other choice after being pinned down and beaten.

    Friends report that Zimmerman cried for days after the shooting. When you consider that Zimmerman was the victim of a violent crime he wanted no part of, this reaction makes sense.

  35. George Zimmerman was a vigilante.
  36. This is a misunderstanding of the word “vigilante.”

    What Zimmerman was doing was absolutely routine, everyday, neighborhood watch stuff. Driving around and reporting anyone suspicious that he didn’t recognize. Being the “eyes and ears” of the community.

    If anything, what Martin did to Zimmerman was vigilantism. Martin assumed Zimmerman was up to no good when he saw him following him, and took it upon himself to dish out his own brand of justice.

  37. The Florida “Stand Your Ground” law applies.
  38. As far as I can tell, it wouldn’t make any difference whether Florida had a “Stand Your Ground” law or not in this case.

    Anywhere in America, if you are being pinned down and beaten in the head, your life is in danger and you have a right to defend yourself against bodily harm with deadly force.

    “Stand your Ground” doesn’t apply when you’re pinned to the ground and being beaten.

  39. Trayvon was only standing his ground as well.
  40. Trayvon had rights in this situation. He had the right to confront Zimmerman and ask why he was being followed. He had the right to be offended and upset about any racial profiling he perceived Zimmerman engaging in.

    And if he felt like Zimmerman was about to attack him for some reason, he may have even had the right to initiate violence to defend himself.

    But Martin had no reason to feel threatened by Zimmerman when Zimmerman never even came close to catching up to him, and was only following from a distance.

    And Martin certainly didn’t have the right to continue to beat Zimmerman indefinitely, while Zimmerman desperately screamed and pleaded for help.

    There is simply no way that behavior can be justified by saying, “Trayvon felt threatened.”

  41. George Zimmerman has no reason to be carrying a gun.
  42. It should be obvious from this case that Zimmerman had every reason to want to carry a gun.

    When someone is willing to assault and beat you simply for approaching them, and so many other people are willing to justify and even rally behind their actions, it’s quite a dangerous society we live in.

  43. It’s about race.
  44. I saved this for last because it’s the biggest misconception of them all.

    Very little of this case has to do with race. Everything here is about violence and assault.

    Race card

    George Zimmerman shot a black teenager. That does not make him racist, because that black teenager had decided to beat him to a pulp.

    I’m fairly certain most gun owners who conceal/carry would shoot anyone who was pinning them down and beating them mercilessly. Race simply does not factor into that equation.

    If George Zimmerman had shot a white teenager who was viciously attacking him, would anyone be saying he had racist motivations? It’s highly doubtful. The majority of people would say, “Of course he shot him, he was being pinned down and being beaten in the head in his own neighborhood.”

    The only aspect of the case that truly relates to race is whether the initial 911 call would have been made if Trayvon wasn’t black.

    While we can’t answer that for certain, I believe the answer is yes.

    George Zimmerman took his job as Neighborhood Watch very seriously, he called in all sorts of stuff, I believe he called Trayvon in because he didn’t recognize him, not because of his color.

    There had been a massive string of burglaries in the area (pdf) in the preceding months.

    Guess how most of the merchandise was recovered? From reporting suspicious people in the neighborhood.

    So this exact type of “suspicious activity” reporting was proven to be effective only weeks earlier. Of course Zimmerman is going to use it.

    Burglaries

    Rpt Date: 2/7/2012 15:06 Reporter: B65567 Blake, James Clearance: 0 Open Narr. Type: S
    Mod By: SANFORD\jhlake Mod Date: 2/7/2012 15:55 Related Case Number: 201250000751

    On 02/07/12 at approximately 1300 hours, I responded to area of 1540 Retreat view Cir in reference to a group of suspicious person(s).

    Sanford Dispatch advised that there were four males on bicycles in the area, that one of them was possibly a suspect in this case.

    Upon arrival myself and Ofc. M. Hickley made contact with three black males and one white male on bicycles in a cut through area of the complex (a grass area were Retreat at Twin Lakes backs up to Colonial Village Apts). The white male had on a white t-shirt and jeans (one black male had on a black shirt and black beanie cap, the other black male had on a red hat and red shorts and the last black male was wearing a black shirt, black jacket and jean shorts and black shoes.)

    Ofc. L. Rivera then arrived on scene; while he and Ofc. Hickley were checking the identifications of the subjects, I made contact with the caller Arnold Arms and lain Beard. Arms and Beard both stated that the black male wearing the black jacket, black shirt, jean shorts, and black shoes was the same black male they saw in the area of 1540 Retreat View Cir on 02/06/12. They also provided a sworn written statement advising that Burgess was wearing the same cloths that he was wearing on 02I06f12.

    While Ofc. Rivera and Ofc. Hickley were trying to verify the identify Mme original gave a false name), I asked Ransburg if
    I could look through his back pack that he was carrying. Ransburg gave me permission to look through his back pack, to which I found two laptop computers. One of the computers was an Apple Macbook Pro, I then asked Ranshurg if the Apple computer belonged to him, to which he replied no. It should be noted that with out any hesitation — told me that the Apple laptop was his computer and that he had bought it last night. l then ran the serial number on the Apple computer (WQOZZRSPATM) through FCIC/NCIC. The computer came hack stolen out of Sanford and came hack to this case number. The other computer came back with negative results at this time.

    If no one had been calling in suspicious people in the neighborhood, this mini-crime spree would never have been solved.

    Twin Lakes is a small gated community, Zimmerman knew who lived there and who didn’t. He didn’t recognize Trayvon.

    That seems to be Zimmerman’s sole motive for calling Trayvon in, nothing more. He wanted to keep his neighborhood free from theft, and reporting suspicious activity had worked well for the community in the previous months.

See more crime scene maps here..

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Black Racism 152 pts

If the parents were absentee parents (which they shown themselves to be), sue them for negligence!

 

If the parents were absentee parents (which they shown themselves to be), sue them for negligence!

 

If the parents were absentee parents (which they shown themselves to be), sue them for negligence!

If the parents were absentee parents (which they shown themselves to be), sue them for negligence!

Randy Pare 30 pts

 Black Racism  If a bigot copies and pastes things enough times, will anyone believe it? LOL not a chance...

Black Racism 152 pts

If the nose is broke, Murder 2 is a joke! If the head is split, acquit!

Black Racism 152 pts

If the head is split, ACQUIT!

If the head is split, ACQUIT!

If the head is split, ACQUIT!

If the head is split, ACQUIT!

 

If the head is split, ACQUIT!

If the head is split, ACQUIT!

If the head is split, ACQUIT!

If the head is split, ACQUIT!

If the head is split, ACQUIT!

If the head is split, ACQUIT!

If the head is split, ACQUIT!

If the head is split, ACQUIT!

If the head is split, ACQUIT!

 

If the head is split, ACQUIT!

 

If the head is split, ACQUIT!

If the head is split, ACQUIT!

If the head is split, ACQUIT!

If the head is split, ACQUIT!

If the head is split, ACQUIT!

If the head is split, ACQUIT!

If the head is split, ACQUIT!

If the head is split, ACQUIT!

If the head is split, ACQUIT!

If the head is split, ACQUIT!

If the head is split, ACQUIT!

If the head is split, ACQUIT!

If the head is split, ACQUIT!

If the head is split, ACQUIT!

If the head is split, ACQUIT!

If the head is split, ACQUIT!

Randy Pare 30 pts

 Black Racism  I think your keyboard is stuck....

Shepherd 60 pts

CR said: You say Martin had no reason to feel threatened, when Zimm says that he was punched when he reached for his pocket.  How did we know Zimm wasn't going for a weapon or not?  Did you think of that Einstein?

So Martin was feeling threatened as he atacked a smaller man and then when he saw him reach for his pocket he felt threatened again.

THEIFAM 854 pts

 Shepherd Shorter man, but by no means smaller who was armed with a gun loaded with hollow point bullets.  Why do you have a problem with what Martin told Dee Dee.  Is she lying for him?  She is not facing murder charges- Zimmerman is.

Rowwdy 8673 pts

 THEIFAM  " Shorter man, but by no means smaller who was armed with a gun loaded with hollow point bullets."

 

He was not near as muscular as Martin.  Did you see the size of Martin' hands compared to Zimmermans?    Martin also towered over Zimmerman.  Height can be an advantage.  Martin was also a street fighter.  Zimmerman was not. 

 

What is your point about hollow points?  At close, it didn't matter what type of round he used. 

 

You have totally ignored the gazillion lies told by the Crump camp and convicted Zimmerman based media hype.

Black Racism 152 pts

 THEIFAM  Shepherd

 Deedee needs to go to jail for her many lies (as do crump & fulton & martin)

Randy Pare 30 pts

 Black Racism   THEIFAM  Shepherd Zimmerman is the only one who needs to spend a long time behind bars. He has already had so many lies an inconsistencies been expose... the guilty verdict will come.

Black Racism 152 pts

 Randy Pare 

Like Casey Anthony, perhury may be the only charge that sticks.

Rest in Peace Trayvon! Justice for ALL!

 
ChristopherRobin 5 pts

You say Martin had no reason to feel threatened, when Zimm says that he was punched when he reached for his pocket.  How did we know Zimm wasn't going for a weapon or not?  Did you think of that Einstein? 

As if following him all night wasn't enough?  That isn't normal behavior and anyone in their right mind would at the least be concerned about some stranger following them. 

 

You say Zimm wasn't chasing Martin.  Well he had to.  How else is going to provide an address or location of a target that is supposedly "running" or wait was that "SKIPPING.  That at the very least indicates he was running because he can't very well keep up with a SKIPPING Martin while walking. 

 

While I don't necessarily condemn Zimm altogether like you do to Martin, I just poke holes in his story.  You aren't doing that.  I'm not even judging Zimm or putting his character into question as you do with Martin.  Just poking holes in his story.  Don't care if Zimm was a thug or maniac, but you care an awful lot about what color Martin's teeth were. 

Rowwdy 8673 pts

 ChristopherRobin "As if following him all night wasn't enough?"

 

"All night"????   There is a stretch and a half.   Who mentioned "skipping"?   Good grief, the nonsensical stuff people come up with.

Raylmt 1069 pts

 Rowwdy  ChristopherRobin

 Skipping could be CRIP or BLOOD walking..look it up on you tube.....like he's being a badass and about to "get a cracka" crip or blood walking before he jacks a cracka..because he's cocky like that....like he was cocky about walking around the car and sizing George up....They(meaning young thugs) like hiding next to bushes by parkinglots or carports..mainly so they can jack the person before they reach the door and rob or just beat the hell out of them.

Marlene Eager 8 pts

You do not know me, and you most certainly do not know where I live, thank goodness, because I believe you are a dangerous person.  I will delete every email now sent to me, because I already said to unfollow this situation and the emails keep coming and they are more vile each time.  I will pray for you.

Marlene Eager 8 pts

Go to church tomorrow and pray.  That is what I am going to do.  I will not follow this post anymore.  Last comment about this.  I will pray for myself and our world.  I am really sorry if I have offended anyone.  These are my beliefs and I do not apologize for them.

Marlene Eager 8 pts

What can you do about yesterday?  Nothing.  Only to learn from it and not repeat yesterday. Have we done that?  No. 

THEIFAM 854 pts

 Marlene Eager If a person breaks his leg yesterday should he not put in a cast today so that it can heal properly?  According to you he should just let it go untreated and end up with a deformed body and a pronounced limp and disability.  That makes no sense.

Marlene Eager 8 pts

Bull Mr. Pare you do play the race card.  You mention it almost in everything you state.  You missed my point on the hoodie.  My point if something as small as wearing a hoodie would profile one of my kids or a loved one and cause the to be profiled I would not alow my child to wear the darn thing up over his/her head on a day that was not cold or rainy.  To wear a hoodie up over their heads to make a statement or in defiance when it would put my loved one in danger is stupid.  The hoodie is not really the issue.  The issue is to keep my child safe.  I say we do not know all the evidence.  Let the courts decide Zimmerman's fate.  I just pray for both.  There are race issues i just wish it could be man vs man no race involved.  If you make any statement it is construed as racists let us quit encouraging this. We are all God's children.  It is just that some of us are lost, but thank goodness God still loves no matter who you are, what you do, how you sin, who you sin against.  God does not walk away from us we walk away from God.  I want justice for both Trayvon Martin (who was almost an adult) and Mr Zimmerman whose hands are not clean.  Not for me to judge, and is not fore you to judge Mr. Pare.

Randy Pare 30 pts

 Marlene Eager There is nothing relevant about Trayvon wearing a hoodie. No hoodie should ever cause anyone to be profiled. BTW - it was raining that night - so all the more reason for the hood to be up [if it was]. Thankfully the courts ARE NOW going to decide the case. But it took a lot of pushing by Trayvon family, the media and supporters to get police and courts to do their job. I think many of us spoke out - because initially the authorities were doing nothing - and that is wrong. Now that the case is before the courts I think most concerned folks are satisfied that the evidence will decide the case.

THEIFAM 854 pts

 Randy Pare  Marlene Eager Rand we have a character in the Dee Dee thread who said that more damage could be sustained by a punch in open space to the head than would be if the head is wedged against concrete and pummeled 15 times.

 

This was his conclusion when faced with the question of why was his nose broken with one punch, but no other damage was sustained to his head 15 punches later with his head wedged against concrete.  

 

 

Rowwdy 8673 pts

 THEIFAM   You still keep posting garbage and you still don't know shit from shinola.  You have your black attitude and that's about it.

THEIFAM 854 pts

 Rowwdy I didn't post you and you are pure garbage so there goes your theory.

Rowwdy 8673 pts

 THEIFAM  Randy Pare  Marlene Eager "but no other damage was sustained to his head 15 punches later with his head wedged against concrete. "

 

WHERE in any report does it say definitively there were "15 punches"?    His head wasn't wedged when Martin started pounding Zimmerman's head AGAINST the concrete.

Rowwdy 8673 pts

 Randy Pare  " There is nothing relevant about Trayvon wearing a hoodie. No hoodie should ever cause anyone to be profiled."

 

It is against the law in the state of FL to wear the hood up. 

THEIFAM 854 pts

 Rowwdy  Randy Pare That's your stupidity shining through as usual Dowdy.   You can't even interpret statutes properly.  

Rowwdy 8673 pts

 THEIFAM  "You can't even interpret statutes properly. "

 

In your dreams.  I interpret laws VERY well.    You and Pare are blantant racists.

Randy Pare 30 pts

 Rowwdy you are entirely full of crapola. No law bans folks from wearing their hoods up in the rain... stop posting nonsense.

FredrickMassey 47 pts

 Marlene Eager

Exactly Marlene,

     Pare is a racist to the core and he conflates internet myth and speculation with logic and proof.  The FBI went home to Eric Holder empty handed.  The FBI, on a mission to please AG Holder, failed to find a scrap of racism in GZ's life and Dandy Randy sees what Fox and Scully and the rest of white America can't?

 

Just curious, you state the state of uncleanliness of Zimmerman's hands.  Based upon what logic and evidence?  I am curious.

 

     Costa Rica and 10 million dollars settlement will do nicely.  George should have never been arrested in the first place.  This a "prevent-the-blacks-from-burning-down-their-own-neighborhoods approach to justice". 

 

Personally, I think GZ ought to go on TV and take his case to the people.  Let the rest of sleeping America what the intellectual dwarfs like Pare are trying to pull.  I would not live in hiding.

 

Remember the Duke boys?  Remember Nifong?  The left never gives up on using the race card.

 

Peace out

Randy Pare 30 pts

 FredrickMassey  Marlene Eager I'm a racist? LOL Coming from you Frederic that is absurdity of the highest order! Witness #9 has shown that there may be a history of racism with Zim after all.

 

No idea what you are talking about unclean hands?!?Zimmerman has contradicted himself when it comes to public statements and police statements - his credibility is shot. 

FredrickMassey 47 pts

 Randy Pare  Marlene Eager 

 

You Are the worst kind of racist Randy.  The world is full of crypto racists like you.

 

I was talking to Marlene re the unclean hands you clown.

 

GZ has no credibility issue.  His credibility is not shot.

 

Trayvon "NO_LIMIT_NIGGA"  Martin got shot.  Pity I wasn't there to enjoy the event.

Randy Pare 30 pts

 FredrickMassey  Marlene Eager have no idea what a "crypto racist" is nor do I care. Spouting hate about how "negroes act" is racism any way you look at it - and that is what you have done repeatedly on this thread.

Rowwdy 8673 pts

 Randy Pare  "Spouting hate about how "negroes act" is racism any way you look at it -"

 

Not if it is true....and it IS true.

 

Indeed you are a racist Pare. 

ArmandK 8 pts

 Randy Pare  FredrickMassey  Marlene Eager 

 

Racist?  You certainly are.

 

You are making decisions about guilt and innocence based not on peoples' acts but on the color of their skin.

 

Crawl back under your rock on your lily-white Canadian town.

THEIFAM 854 pts

 FredrickMassey  Randy Pare  Marlene Eager GZ has no credibility issue.  For once we agree.  That's because he has no credibility. He has no credibility to be shot.

 

You weren't there for TM getting shot.  Just make sure your there when GZ gets sentenced and the cuffs are slapped on him right before they drag his behind away.

THEIFAM 854 pts

 FredrickMassey  Marlene Eager There was no history of sickness or violence in James Holmes's life.  Does that mean that on July 20th he wasn't sick or violent?  Your puerile and ignorant conclusions will not amount to a hill of beans in a courtroom.  No juror is going to conclude that a man who consistently called the police on black suspects, and assumed that Trayvon Martin was a criminal simply because he was like the other ones who were victimizing the neighborhood (the other ones just happening to be black), wasn't doing so because he was profiling black suspects.  Only racist and blind people can see that simple fact.

 

You don't need Eric Holder and the FBI to draw those conclusions.  The reason why they were brought in was not to establish his racial profiling but to see how pervasive it was.  Apparently he didn't get that way until he got a loaded firearm with hollow point bullets in it in his possession.  That makes sense.  He shows his true colors when he has a gun in his hand.  

Rowwdy 8673 pts

 Marlene Eager "There are race issues i just wish it could be man vs man no race involved."

 

It would have been if Crump and Sharpton had stayed out of it.  Then the parents jumped on the gravy train.  What decent mother trademarks her son's name, much less does before he is even buried?  

Randy Pare 30 pts

 Rowwdy  Marlene Eager you know the truth about the trademark BS so why bring up that red herring and present it as a character smear?

Randy Pare 30 pts

Now we are finding out that Zimmerman may have had a history of racism - as well as sexual assault.

FredrickMassey 47 pts

 Randy Pare 

 

"We are left only with his race as a possible reason for Zim to find him suspicious."

 

Hey moron.

     Eric Holder's boys went to Sanford, did their Civil Rights thing and went home.  Look it up.  NO EVIDENCE OF RACISM IN GEORGE ZIMMERMAN'S LIFE.

 

   That must really burn your ass.

 

Like I said, we gotta keep the prisons free and open for white criminals.  That's why this is such a good thing.  Ya gotta make room for white crooks and rapists.  That means either the blacks cut back on the armed robbery and rape (and you know that ain't gonna happen) or you shoot them before they clog up the court system.

 

Works for me.

Randy Pare 30 pts

 FredrickMassey Witness # 9 - evidence of possible racism and you are a f@cking racist.... wow how many swastikas you got? 

 

"That means either the blacks cut back on the armed robbery and rape (and you know that ain't gonna happen) or you shoot them before they clog up the court system.

 

Works for me."

 

---- I am thoroughly disgusted.

FredrickMassey 47 pts

 Randy Pare  cking 

 

I understand you Randy.  You must be filled with white guilt.  It is a disease that only socialists and racists suffer from.  I only want peace and love in the world. 

 

You want a lynchmob.

 

 

That is the key difference between us.

Randy Pare 30 pts

 FredrickMassey I don't want a lynch mob - EVER. All anyone wanted was for the police to NOT sweep under rug [as they initially did]. 

 

YOU Frederick made plenty of vile racist comments about African-Americans... which I cannot understand in this day and age.That is the key difference between us. 

FredrickMassey 47 pts

 Randy Pare 

 

Randy, Randy, Randy........you are another sad victim of the feminization of American males.  Like a horse that gets gelded before he gets to get  a mare........you don't even know what I'm talking about.

Randy Pare 30 pts

 FredrickMassey the one thing you are right about - I have no idea what you are talking about. No ethnic group is "evil" 

FredrickMassey 47 pts

 Randy Pare 

"I have no idea what you are talking about. No ethnic group is "evil""

 

The Borg are evil,  ergo you are wrong.

 

And what you don't know covers a lot of territory.

Randy Pare 30 pts

 Raylmt That video is filled with distortion, exaggeration and outright lies.

Marlene Eager 8 pts

Here is my complaint to Randy Pare.  If you do not agree with him then you are a racist.  Trayvon Martin is not a saint.  He is not the clean cut kid that they at first stated in the news.  Neither man was an angel.  I do believe Zimmerman shot him in self defense, but I also believe he did persue him when asked not to do so by dispatcher.  I believe Mr Zimmerman should be charged with something, but I do not believe he should be charged with murder.  About the hoodies if wearing a hoodie would cause me or a loved one to be profiled and possibly cause danger to me or a loved one.  Do not wear them.  Clothing is not worth a life.  That stupid picture of grown men wearing the hoodies in support of Trayvon Martin was not the support this young man or his family needed.  Wearing hoodies vs a death, great cause, not.  It is true if this young man would have been white, asian, hispanic etc.... the shooting would not have been the big deal it has become.  People like you Mr. Pare keep the race card going.  It is two people not black not white where a tragedy occured.  I wil pray for both families. 

Randy Pare 30 pts

 Marlene Eager "Neither man was an angel" -- does not begin to describe these two. I don't think anyone has claimed Trayvon was a saint [none of us are] BUT and this is important, he was a teenager and he had NO history of violence. That is relevant. The possibility that he may have smoked pot [OMG - what a scandal a teenager who smoked pot! LOL] has no bearing on him being killed. Zimmerman on the other hand has a history of violence. He has been quite fortunate, until now, to keep getting away with it. I don't know why - I can only guess that his parent's connections played a part. And you bring up the hoodie again???? LOL Please, even Geraldo knows he was an idiot for making that connection. Everyone from soccer moms to senior citizens to kids wear hoodies - they ARE NOT a reason to profile anyone as being dangerous - It's just a sweatshirt with a hood fer pete's sake. I am not playing a race card - I am pointing out that nothing in Zimmerman's continuing changing statements has shown reason for him to suspect Trayvon as suspicious. The hoodie was not suspicious, walking home from the convenience store is not suspicious. We are left only with his race as a possible reason for Zim to find him suspicious. But ultimately, even that is irrelevant to the case.The case revolves around a violent man causing a violent tragedy and he should pay in order to send a message to other vigilante wanna be's. 

Trackbacks

  1. [...] site Wagist has the very best update (at this point in time – but that is redundant) on the Trayvon [...]

  2. [...] the actions in a man. Zimmerman and his wife were in the big brother / big sister program and mentored two black children. That doesn’t sound like the actions of a racist to me. "Danielle–she's like our [...]

  3. [...] is actually a pretty good read: Misconceptions in the Trayvon Martin Case Reply With [...]

  4. [...] Misconceptions in the Trayvon Martin Case more new facts. *Zimmerman weighs 170 lbs. He weighed 250 when the mugshot was taken, and lost loads of weight since then. *he talked with police without an attorney present for 5 hours. *The racist vigilante had volunteered in the Big Brother program and mentored 2 black kids.   [...]

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